Gunfire and CI

[CILaitinen]

Hello!

Are there any CI users out there who are hunters or gun enthusiasts?  I am a hunter and my son wears bilateral CIs.  He is 8 so he is beginning to make treks to the woods with me.  So far I have not brought him hunting because I don't want to cause pain or damage if he is wearing his processors and I fire at small game.  From what I understand from our Audiologist, the CI has a limiting type of effect, which means it will only have a certain "loudness" to the CI user and it will not cause pain or damage.  I would love to hear from actual users though who may have had experience with this.  Thanks

Dean Laitinen

[Adam]

Dean

That is a great question

The short answer is that you have a number of really good sound cancelling ear protection out there that he could wear.

 

Also the way the implants work is, they have automatic gain control. this basically means that the processors are constantly checking the environment around the person and can adjust on the fly without you doing anything or causing too loud sounds to be well too loud.

 

It does this by using 2 detectors

One detector analyses rather slowly (on the order of several hundred milliseconds). The other analyses quickly. You can almost imagine the slow detector analysing at a relatively slow “rate,” checking in now and then to see what the overall level is. The fast detector is analysing very quickly – it is looking for loud, transient sounds.Both of these detectors have the ability to change the gain of the microphone. Usually the slow detector is in control (even though both are always working). So if the overall sound level of the environment changes (as when walking from a quiet room to a noisy room), the slow detector adjusts the microphone gain to be sure the input is within the sound processing window of the implant system. But if the fast detector notices a sound that exceeds the slow detector by more than 6 dB in a very short time period, it quickly takes control, reduces the gain of the microphone (if necessary), and then gives control back to the slow detector. The slow detector then just picks up right where it left off - because the overall sound level didn’t really change. This allows the management of the transient sound to be handled without the user noticing any negative effects.

 

Although Medel has some things built in to protect against too looud or harmful noises, my thought is SAFETY FIRST. If you can get a good set of noise protecting ear protection, i would. I have bilateral implants and wear headpghones to listen to music and it does not interfere with the processors at all. I would also touch base with your audi to see what He/She says.

 

Probably way more info than you wanted 

 

Adam

[drobinson]

I am a gun enthusiast and also where bi-lateral CIs.  You still need to protect your ears!  I have experienced pain from loud noises (not guns).  I still use hearing protection at the range.  CIs will cease to work if you further damage your audio 'nerves'.  Have your son where ear muff type protection, not earplugs.  Earplugs don't work with CIs since the processor is outside the ear.

[CILaitinen]

Thanks Adam and Donald….great info here….I did have one thought.   My son is about to be fitted for Rondos.  If he goes out with me wearing the Rondos, but then I also put plugs in his ears to protect his ear drum, inner ear, etc. from the pain of a big vibration (even though that is not where he is hearing the actual noise from), shouldn't the processor sound suppression along with the plugs allow him to hear while out there, but protect the inner parts of the ear?  I'll have to ask audi about this.  I did discuss it with her but she had to try and talk with other users who hunt to find out how they deal with it, and the answer still kind of varies.  But I hear what you are saying Donald about safety first anyway.

thanks

Dean

[jpl2ci]

Dean, I suggest turning the sensitivity and volume way down on the RONDO. Also, I suggest wearing the OPUS2, not the RONDO if you will be tromping through the woods. The RONDO is susceptible to being knocked off when climbing over/under fences, crossing streams, errant tree limbs, etc. Ear Gears is testing RONDO prototypes but the finished product is not yet finalized.  I would hate to see your son lose his RONDOs in the UP and have to go see Trolls for repairs.

[weimar]

I am a firearms instructor and teach handguns, shotguns and patrol rifle classes for my department (and a few others) regularly.  That said - I wear hearing protection for a number of reasons (1- I don't follow the "do as I say, not as I do" adage and 2- guns make loud sounds (gunshot) and repeatedly exposing yourself to such loud sounds causes damage).  A lot depends on the amount of shooting being done and the environment that you're in.  If you're hunting, you're likely only shooting a couple shots and are in an open area.  This is ideal because the shots aren't as loud in this environment and aren't as damaging since there's only one/two shot(s).

 

Alternately, if you're at a range - the gunshots seem to be amplified as they have nowhere to go to dissipate.  Couple that amplification with an inordinate number of gunshots and you pretty much make a great scenario for hearing damage.  It's even worse inside an indoor range.

 

The short answer is that you should always wear hearing protection.  It's not always prudent in a hunting environment and if you're still concerned,  you could always invest in some electronic protectors that cut-off the sounds once they reach a certain decibel level.

 

I have 2 programs that I use when I'm teaching - one cuts the volume down to 10% because when I'm running the range, I don't really need to hear well enough to carry a conversation anyway.  When I do need to have a conversation, the 10% is still enough for me to participate (PLUS I'm wearing my hearing protection).  The other program drops the volume down to 0% - this was done so that when I enter a loud concert, indoor range, etc. I can quickly/immediately dump the volume without have to turn it off (I like to be discreete with it).

 

Hope this helps - this is a topic I'm passionate about so don't hesitate if you have more.

[CILaitinen]

Its been a while since I have been on this topic but thanks Chuckie, I appreciate the info.  At this point, if I am understanding correctly, the processors can have a program which, when chosen, brings the sound volume way down.  In addition, hearing protection needs to be worn in ears to suppress the vibration from the loud sound, which itself can cause further internal ear damage, even if the sound is not perceived as loud by my son.  If I apply hearing protection and also he has a program activated for processors which limits loud noise, he could wear his processors in the woods while hunting without damage to his inner ear or the CI equipment.  That about this gist of it?