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Ivana Marinac

Guide for a music rehabilitation: step by step.

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Opening a discussion on this very interesting subject - aural rehabilitation and specifically ask participants how did you start the rehabilitation: which music do you like, what kind of music has shown first results, how did you build further walls of speech understanding and music appreciation, etc. :)

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My first CI (right) didn't really take to music until month 3 or 4. My second CI (left) loved music by week 4.

I listened to familiar music and just enjoyed whatever I could get from it. Great percussion, more and more instruments, a phrase here and there, etc. I approached music as something I would have to train. I listen to music often. I listened whether it sounded good or bad. I exposed my brain to the way music sounds through my CIs and let my brain figure it out.

Now I can learn new lyrics just by listening to new songs. I am also finding out that some lyrics I thought I knew are incorrect!

I attend musical shows and in fact will be attending a concert tomorrow.

Exposure, patience and plasticity! Smile

I love music.

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For me it's still new. I downloaded the lyrics to one of my CDs and I listen to them over and over well not eve ruddy but almost and I am trying to,listen without the lyrics once I know them well. It's still a bit tricky but I am able to understand almost all the lyrics now. Then I will move on to lyrics I already know. And listen just so my brain can adapt to the music side the precision and instruments. That is not so good yet. Or whistling that sounds really put of tune right now so I do that too. Or I sing to myself. Because my voice sounds horrible now with my CI. So I have to adapt to that too. I will update later as to how it's going.

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Mary Beth, how did you like the yesterday's concert? Do you notice the difference in your perception of live music vs. recorded?

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Yes - I am also anxious to read your experience Mary Beth :)

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For me it's still new. I downloaded the lyrics to one of my CDs and I listen to them over and over well not eve ruddy but almost and I am trying to,listen without the lyrics once I know them well. It's still a bit tricky but I am able to understand almost all the lyrics now. Then I will move on to lyrics I already know. And listen just so my brain can adapt to the music side the precision and instruments. That is not so good yet. Or whistling that sounds really put of tune right now so I do that too. Or I sing to myself. Because my voice sounds horrible now with my CI. So I have to adapt to that too. I will update later as to how it's going.

Horrible...:D

C'mon...

But - great step forward, sounds more than promising. :)

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Hi Ivana and Cara,

We gave my CIs quite a work out this weekend! It was awesome!

What a difference from before.

Saturday evening we went to a music concert by Bonnie Raitt. There was an opening music group that played for 45 minutes. 5 members - vocals, tenor saxophone, electric guitar, electric bass guitar, electronic keyboard, trumpet, washboard (some members switched instruments). We were sitting near the back of the theater and the theater was not looped so I stayed on M and was too far away for any speech reading. I could distinguish all of the instruments and I even understood many lyrics of songs I had never heard before. It was amazing.

Then Bonnie Raitt came on with her band (5 members- vocals, various electric and acoustic guitars, huge drum set, electronic keyboard as well as piano). I knew many of these songs so it was not really a test of listening. However, during one song I tested out what the concert would've sounded like if I only had my right CI or if I only had my left CI by popping off the D-coils briefly. Each CI has its own strengths and the best sound was from being bilateral.

Then we drove into New York City because I have a mapping appointment tomorrow morning and were able to get discounted tickets for a Broadway musical- Fiddler On The Roof. That theater did not have a loop either and we were sitting high and far back so again no speech reading. I sat in shock that I was understanding so much of the dialogue. I know many of the songs so that wasn't a true test of listening comprehension but I didn't know the dialogue. Wow, these CIs are amazing.

Then, no kidding, as we were walking back to the hotel we ran into co-workers from home who were also in NYC this weekend. So standing on a busy corner in NYC with cars, horns, people, etc surrounding us we chatted and I heard everything they said.

I am really shocked. But this has been the way the journey has gone for me. It hasn't been a steady gradual change. It's been punctuated by events that amaze me.

The most difficult listening task of the past two days was understanding what Bonnie Raitt said in between songs. I was told that her mic was acting weird so maybe that was part of it. Maybe it was just my listening skills.

Flashback to last summer, when my right CI was 3-4 months old, and I clearly recall how bad music sounded to me. In fact driving in the car, listening to Tracy Chapman, I was working on trying to guess some lyrics. I was able to get some lyrics correct and people were amazed. Then I told them that no one would pay to attend the concert I was listening to! It sounded awful. Music came slower than speech for me but it is here now and it is amazing.

Cara- live music does sound different than recorded music -whether that is because it is a multi-sensory experience or due to acoustics. It sure is fun watching skilled musicians and matching the instruments voice to the sound.

Sure hope your weekends were just as grand,

Mary Beth

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I see that now Ivana!! Darn auto correct does weird things sometime. Lol!! Glad to hear Mary Beth that you had a great weekend!!

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Mary Beth, glad for you having such good day and results! So far it is hard for me to believe that I will reach the same point soon, but I know that I have no choice :)

 

I also noticed, that live music sounds different and better for me. Trying to use any opportunity to expose my new ear to that.

 

I believe you can read music scores and partitures. Is it correct? Have you ever tried to follow that while listening to music like reading along with audio books?

Wondering if this can help to hear tunes properly faster and distinguish different musical instruments easily. 

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I see that now Ivana!! Darn auto correct does weird things sometime. Lol!! Glad to hear Mary Beth that you had a great weekend!!

 

Well - it could be even worse like ... Horny?  :lol:  :lol:

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Brilliant Mary Beth...:)

 

Actually, the quality of music heavily depends on acoustics and I can not imagine the situation where some regular system can be compared with a real concert hall. I even have some books regarding the acoustics and physics of concert halls :)

 

Before, with my hearing aid I never liked live versions because it was "messy" music without "prelearnt" parts or songs in advance - it is much different now, I enjoy unspeakably more now with only one implant than with hearing aid.

 

Disclaimer: I am user of the BB, not a CI. (This is a guide for a CI users). :) 

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So, Mary Beth: would you recommend people to listen everything no matter of the topic and that results came just with the exposition or would you recommend better building the understanding? For instance, hearing percussion or piano instruments and after that building a symphonic orchestra?

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I would recommend that you should start as small as possible just like you said. Percussion and piano then orchestra but I wouldnt limit. I would test each ans see where you stand individually.

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Thanks!

I would recommend that people listen to all different kinds of music with realistic expectations. I did not add music into my training in the first few months after activation. I was busy enough trying to train for speech. When I did start listening to music daily, I had already experienced how static and beeps could turn into clear speech so I was ready to let music start its own journey.

Following along with the musical score is a good idea, Cara. However, you may want to wait a little bit to start.

Here's an example of why trying too soon is pointless. Early on I had a friend play two tones on an electric keyboard. I was only trying to determine if they were the same or different. I could not do it. I just put that task aside for several months. When I returned to it, I could do it. Our brains are being asked to process sounds they have never heard before. We need to be kind to our brains. Smile.

Add music when you are ready. Let your brain pick up what it can. Find happiness in the sounds your brain recognized. Repeat MANY MANY MANY times. Smile. Then when you least expect it, you will find yourself singing along to a new song.

I hope my lack of an analytical approach to music doesn't disappoint you Ivana. Smile. I approached speech training very analytically but I exposed my brain to music in a more holistic fashion.

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Not at all Mary Beth - actually, you were very informative. ;)

I was always asking myself where people dissapoint themselves... Where they go wrong and why at certain step they just stop...?

but you further clarified topic: first start with speech, than with music. Above all - think about patience, practice and perseverance! :)

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I would recommend that you should start as small as possible just like you said. Percussion and piano then orchestra but I wouldnt limit. I would test each ans see where you stand individually.

Well, you're next to jump over, Kara! ;):D

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Adam is missing... :(

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I miss Adam too!

Ivana,

We were just discussing how some people get disappointed and stop training today. I've noticed that many people start their hearing journey actively seeking information, preparing for auditory rehab, posting often on Hears Peers or the Facebook group, etc. Some of those people stay committed to auditory rehab. Others don't. It seems impossible to predict which people will stay actively training and which people will stop training.

In the group that doesn't train at all or stops early, there appear to be two sub-groups

-those who are happy with their CIs and find they don't need to actively train

-those who are not satisfied with their CIs but also choose not to train any longer (speech or music or both).

As a teacher and just a naturally curious person, I find myself wondering how we can help those people who are not satisfied but also no longer training. Not everyone can create and follow a self-directed training program successfully. I believe many of these people can be helped and can find more satisfying hearing with their CIs. I wonder how we can reach out and help them?

I am aware that there are some people who actively train and still do not receive a satisfactory level with their CIs. I feel for those people. If there aren't enough nerve endings to deliver enough of the message, the brain just doesn't have the info it needs to be successful. How very frustrating for them I'm sure.

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I hope Adam is doing well, just is busy happily.

 

Following along with the musical score is a good idea, Cara. However, you may want to wait a little bit to start.

.

 

I just expose myself to music, when I have time - 25 minutes to drive to get to work and then back. I am back at the square one after the first mapping and cannot get any tunes with implanted ear only. Like your said currently I more concentrated to be more fluent with a speech recognition. But it is also not so easy as it was after activation as now I have double "channeled hearing" - sorry I don't know how to put it in words. I hear the real voice (very quite) and at the same time I hear a robotic voice (much louder). I make me confused which of two I need to try hear and understand as they both sound quite competing for me. I have some progress with this. But looks it is going to take some time till it is resolved.

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Cara,

I experienced that double channeled hearing as well with my first CI. I called it layered hearing. The real person's voice with an R2D2 voice layered over it. For me it peeled away like this.

First only heard R2D2 voice

Next heard the layered voices- this progressed like being peeled away with the real voice getting louder and the R2D2 voice getting quieter

Then only the real voice

Try to focus on the real voice if you can but either way, it will peel away and you will be left with just the real voice eventually.

Also, setbacks after new mapping appointments is quite common. I had to go back to easier training steps and then progress forward again several different times.

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Thanks for telling me that, Mary Beth. Good to know that the layered earing and setback after mapping is pretty common.

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I miss Adam too!

Ivana,

We were just discussing how some people get disappointed and stop training today. I've noticed that many people start their hearing journey actively seeking information, preparing for auditory rehab, posting often on Hears Peers or the Facebook group, etc. Some of those people stay committed to auditory rehab. Others don't. It seems impossible to predict which people will stay actively training and which people will stop training.

In the group that doesn't train at all or stops early, there appear to be two sub-groups

-those who are happy with their CIs and find they don't need to actively train

-those who are not satisfied with their CIs but also choose not to train any longer (speech or music or both).

As a teacher and just a naturally curious person, I find myself wondering how we can help those people who are not satisfied but also no longer training. Not everyone can create and follow a self-directed training program successfully. I believe many of these people can be helped and can find more satisfying hearing with their CIs. I wonder how we can reach out and help them?

I am aware that there are some people who actively train and still do not receive a satisfactory level with their CIs. I feel for those people. If there aren't enough nerve endings to deliver enough of the message, the brain just doesn't have the info it needs to be successful. How very frustrating for them I'm sure.

 

 

Mary Beth,

 

I would sign your words if I could. :)

That`s why I have titled this topic as a GUIDE - to help people how to start or how to return if they wander of the path. As a doc I usually find a frustration at patients when they do not know how to proceed, is certain situation really everything what a modern science can offer etc.

I guess everything can be potentially helpful. 

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Hey everyone

For me, music and the phone took the longest to come back. I stuck with songs that I knew very well when growing up. For the longest time, it just sounded like mush. i couldn't make anything out. The drums were the first for me to be able to pick out. Then slowly but surely, things started to fall into place. Once I recognized the song, it was like lifting a blanket off of a speaker and I could hear it clearly. Then the recognition of songs started to come faster and faster. Now I can turn on the radio and know what's playing, straight away. I waited quite a while before using any ALDs at the request of my Audi as she wanted my brain to do the work

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Hey everyone

For me, music and the phone took the longest to come back. I stuck with songs that I knew very well when growing up. For the longest time, it just sounded like mush. i couldn't make anything out. The drums were the first for me to be able to pick out. Then slowly but surely, things started to fall into place. Once I recognized the song, it was like lifting a blanket off of a speaker and I could hear it clearly. Then the recognition of songs started to come faster and faster. Now I can turn on the radio and know what's playing, straight away. I waited quite a while before using any ALDs at the request of my Audi as she wanted my brain to do the work

 

Hey Adam,

 

approximately how long did you need to start recognizing anything? Also, drums were first which appeared to you - it's quite often that it starts like that.

Then I guess this should be a first layer? Oftenly, people do not have enough patience to listen something which does not work for them - too long. I guess a fraction of problem is also in that detail. :)

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In response to Mary Beth's post about people who stop training, I wonder if Motivation, Expectation, Time, Patience, and/or Support has anything to do with their reasons of not training or to stop training?

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